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[Iggy Pop]:
Previously on Punk...
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♪ Ah-na-na-na ♪
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Bonk!
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I just wanted to shock people
out of their normalcy.
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[Legs McNeil]:
I mean, come on,
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the greatest fuckin' lyrics in the...
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Well, besides the Ramones.
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Hello.
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"Kick out the jams,
motherfuckers."
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The grown-ups
were fucking this up big time.
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[Johnny Rotten]: I've learned
that telling the truth
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is a very good way of life...
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...but there's this mediocrity
that journalists create
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that still want you to believe
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that this is something of a sham
and a joke.
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[David Vanian]:
When all this first started,
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there was no word "punk."
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As soon as the word "punk"
went up in Britain,
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it was something
to be disdained, you know,
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it was something terrible,
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and the press just made it worse.
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The cult is called punk,
the music, punk rock.
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Basic rock music,
raw, outrageous, and crude.
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I mean, they just looked at us
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as though we were kind of weird,
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like, why were we doing this?
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And we were very,
very aware of a few bands
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across the sea in New York
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who were sort of in the same mindset.
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[Terry Chimes]: And we weren't
trying to be like them,
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and they weren't trying to be like us.
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It was just two parallel things.
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[Joe Strummer]:
We are the real McCoy.
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We're not going to just fold up,
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and in a few weeks,
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you'll wonder what all that was about.
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We're going to be here,
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and continuing to get harder,
and rougher, and tough.
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That's what music
is supposed to be teaching us.
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Have you been taught?
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[♪♪♪]
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[screaming and cheering]
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[♪♪♪]
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[drum roll]
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["God Save the Queen" plays]
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[♪♪♪]
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[song ends with a drum roll]
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[Johnny Rotten]: Finsbury Park
was the area I grew up in.
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We'll call it North London.
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At seven, I contracted meningitis.
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I went into a coma.
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When I came out of that,
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which was something like
three months later,
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I had no memory at all.
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I remembered nothing of anything.
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Not a knife, a fork,
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no physical co-ordination,
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and I'd be having intense, nasty visions
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and nightmares.
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Well, I went through that.
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Four years it took
to fully recover my memories,
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but all the way through,
still, music was there,
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because my mum and dad,
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they were really avid record collectors,
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so I grew up with reggae
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just as well as I did with The Kinks,
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just as well as I did
with Irish folk dancing,
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and the traditional Irish singers,
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and everything,
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everything and anything,
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and classical music too,
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and somehow Iggy Pop's in there.
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[♪♪♪]
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♪ Yeah! ♪
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[♪♪♪]
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♪ Dance to the beat
of the livin' dead ♪
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♪ Lose sleep, baby
and stay away from bed... ♪
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I loved that growly voice.
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Oh, my God, I'd never
heard that in rock music.
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That "rawr"...
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just rippin' it up,
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and there was this, like,
hardcore, in your face,
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violent sound
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that absolutely upset
everything inside your head.
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Loved it.
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I thought it was the essence
of pure, hardcore rock.
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Not rock 'n' roll. Rock.
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[Viv Albertine]:
Iggy Pop was very revered,
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and he embodied the whole
punk spirit for me,
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and when he came across to London,
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it was so exciting.
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[♪♪♪]
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But if you trace everything back, man,
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all roads stop with Iggy Pop.
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He struck a chord
with the UK punk movement
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like no other American band.
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[♪♪♪]
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♪ Everybody always trying
to tell me what to do ♪
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At the time that punk
was starting to re-emerge
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through The Damned
and the Sex Pistols in London,
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I was on the continent
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thinking in a whole other direction.
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[David Bowie]: There was
something with Jimmy
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that I hadn't seen in rock and roll,
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an unleashing of
the animalistic kinds of rock
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that you never really see.
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It's always usually safeguarded,
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and very, very safe.
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Do you feel you've influenced anybody?
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I think I helped wipe out the '60s.
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[laughter]
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[applause]
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[Pop]: And so everybody
was having a good time,
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but in England,
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the whole subject was taken
much more seriously,
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and it wasn't until
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they actually had to deal
with the Sex Pistols
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that all of a sudden
the cat was out of the bag.
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♪ ...and we don't care... ♪
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[♪♪♪]
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♪ Don't ask us to attend
'cause we aren't all there ♪
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♪ Don't pretend
yeah, we don't care ♪
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♪ I got no reason
it's all too much ♪
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♪ You'll always find us ♪
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♪ Out to lunch... ♪
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[Rotten]:
We weren't liked,
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but then again,
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all of our early gigs, we weren't liked.
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I never heard myself,
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just like in rehearsals,
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because we had no monitors, you know?
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Our genius of a manager
never thought that, you know,
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a lead singer might like
to hear himself.
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So for me, it was just
a puzzle in that band, really,
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right up to the first time
we actually had monitors,
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of why they were telling me I was awful.
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I was imagining I was, oh, my god,
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Roy Orbison, you know?
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That ain't what was going on at all.
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The first time I did
hear myself with monitors
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was at the 100 Club,
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supporting a band
called Eddie and the Hot Rods.
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They had monitors,
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and they were very, very,
very kind to loan them to us,
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and that backfired really badly,
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because the second I heard
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what I really, really sounded like,
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it made me furious.
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So rather than blame myself,
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[chuckling]
I blamed the monitors...
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and the mic stand went through,
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and I caused some damage
to their personal property,
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and I still feel very bad about that,
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but not really.
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[♪♪♪]
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Malcolm.
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It's not complicated, really.
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There was a man
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who wanted to grab
all the attention for himself
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and be seen as a genius.
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[Vanian]:
The Clash, The Damned,
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and the Sex Pistols
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all had people working for them,
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or managers,
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who were maybe 10 years older,
and had been in the rag trade,
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so they were all very similar,
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but they understood that something good
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and interesting was happening,
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and they wanted to
get a piece of it, basically.
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[Rotten]: We did all the work,
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us, the band.
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We wrote the songs.
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We went out and endured the audiences,
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and he would sit in an office
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and plan on buying a new lampshade,
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or things like that,
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but never really interested
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in what the runnings of all of this was,
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until, of course, good reviews
started coming in.
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I played the part of being a manager.
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I didn't do much managing.
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I did a lot of mismanaging.
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[laughs]
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[Vanian]: Malcolm.
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We used to call him "Malcolm
What-Can-I-Do-You-For,"
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basically, because he was a...
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he was a very
Fagin-type character to us,
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I thought, you know.
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He's not the kind of guy
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I would want to have
as my manager at the time,
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or anything.
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He was just the guy
who ran the clothes shop,
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as far as I knew.
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[♪♪♪]
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The only reason I think
I ever went to his shop
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was that I had a girlfriend at the time
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that wanted to buy a pair
of high-heeled shoes.
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I suppose I was no different
than any young guy back then.
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You know, it wasn't so much
an angry time,
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but a hell of a lot of frustration.
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The worst thing, I think, was
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you've come out of school, you're...
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and there's no work,
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and I hadn't signed on the dole
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because I thought I'd like
to work and make some money,
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but it came to a point where I had to,
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and I was walking down this hill,
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and there was an old cemetery,
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Heath Lane Cemetery,
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and there was a guy in it,
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and he was digging a grave
whilst whistling to himself,
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but very happy...
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[whistling]
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...and I thought
if I did that job temporarily,
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it wasn't a job where I'd
have to think about anything.
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I could get the work done
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and get down to London,
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and see if I could do something,
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whatever it was going to be,
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and so I ended up being a gravedigger,
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and it was the perfect...
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the perfect thing,
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'cause I had some money in my pocket.
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London at that time was...
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you know, you didn't know
what it was, even,
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but everybody was very frenetic
with excitement,
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and there were writers and artists
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and people that would become
bands and musicians.
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You'd end up going down,
and you'd meet up with someone,
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you'd end up in some house,
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or a gig, or whatever,
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and then eventually,
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I suddenly ended up in The Damned.
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♪ One, two, three! ♪
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♪ Oh, she's so ♪
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♪ Messed up ♪
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♪ She don't even ball ♪
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♪ Well, she's so messed up ♪
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♪ She has no fun at all ♪
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♪ She's a sad case ♪
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♪ Of hit and run ♪
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♪ I think that I ♪
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♪ Would rather
fuck her mum... ♪
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[Vanian]: It was funny,
because in those early years,
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you would meet people
with similar interests,
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and they invariably would look different
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than the normal person
on the street in some way.
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The Kings Road became a place
where people congregated,
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and bands used to go there
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because they would shop in that area.
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There was really
weird designers and clothes.
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It was no longer about
wearing the uniform.
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It was "do whatever you want.
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Be your own person.
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Create your own style.
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Make your own clothes."
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It was the beginning of all of that.
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I think it scared the shit
out of the adults,
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but for the kids, they loved it.
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[horn honking]
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[laughter]
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[Rotten]: Before the leather
jackets and the studs
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was true punk,
which was a mismatch of things.
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Maybe one designer piece,
265
00:12:00,170 --> 00:12:04,010
but you'd have to make sure
the designer was the right one,
266
00:12:04,030 --> 00:12:06,040
and the right one at that time
267
00:12:06,060 --> 00:12:07,230
was Vivienne Westwood.
268
00:12:08,010 --> 00:12:09,210
[Vivienne Westwood]:
You can undo the hooks
269
00:12:09,230 --> 00:12:11,200
and tie them together if you want to.
270
00:12:11,220 --> 00:12:14,020
There's also a hole here.
271
00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:16,000
I could put my arms through there,
272
00:12:16,020 --> 00:12:19,190
and use this sleeve as scarves, right?
273
00:12:20,150 --> 00:12:21,210
[Albertine]:
A couple of days a week,
274
00:12:21,230 --> 00:12:25,040
me and my friends, we'd go up to Sex,
275
00:12:25,060 --> 00:12:27,190
Vivienne Westwood and
Malcolm McLaren's clothes shop
276
00:12:27,210 --> 00:12:29,210
at the end of the King's Road.
277
00:12:29,230 --> 00:12:32,190
How she was about clothes and fashion
278
00:12:32,210 --> 00:12:34,130
absolutely influenced me,
279
00:12:34,150 --> 00:12:37,110
and gave me the courage
to start to try and write songs,
280
00:12:37,130 --> 00:12:39,090
because Vivienne would take
something like a t-shirt,
281
00:12:39,110 --> 00:12:41,070
she'd get a batch of t-shirts
from India.
282
00:12:41,090 --> 00:12:42,140
They didn't look right.
283
00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:45,010
The collars weren't right,
the sleeves weren't right,
284
00:12:45,030 --> 00:12:46,040
and so she'd say, "Right,
285
00:12:46,060 --> 00:12:47,070
I'm going to cut the collars off,
286
00:12:47,090 --> 00:12:49,060
cut the sleeves off, cut the bottom off,
287
00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:50,060
can't be bothered to sew them,
288
00:12:50,080 --> 00:12:51,120
leave them frayed,
289
00:12:51,140 --> 00:12:55,140
and write something
really powerful, shocking,
290
00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:58,100
that's going to grab attention
across the front,"
291
00:12:58,120 --> 00:13:00,170
and what that taught me
292
00:13:00,190 --> 00:13:02,040
was it doesn't matter
if you sing a bit out of tune,
293
00:13:02,060 --> 00:13:03,050
out of time.
294
00:13:03,070 --> 00:13:04,090
What have you got to say?
295
00:13:06,180 --> 00:13:08,080
[Don Letts]:
The style, the look,
296
00:13:08,100 --> 00:13:10,080
her kind of a visionary take
297
00:13:10,100 --> 00:13:13,040
on the possibilities of what
you can do with clothes,
298
00:13:13,060 --> 00:13:15,030
and the statements that they can make.
299
00:13:15,050 --> 00:13:16,100
I mean, listen, in England, you know,
300
00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:18,120
clothes and music,
they're like this, man.
301
00:13:18,140 --> 00:13:20,010
You really can't separate them,
302
00:13:20,030 --> 00:13:22,100
much more so than in the States.
303
00:13:23,130 --> 00:13:24,530
[Pam Hogg]:
When I went to New York,
304
00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,050
I was expecting to walk down the street
305
00:13:27,070 --> 00:13:30,040
and see everyone looking
like the New York Dolls,
306
00:13:30,060 --> 00:13:32,080
and like... you know?
307
00:13:32,100 --> 00:13:35,110
When I was in London, you know,
it was a mental scene.
308
00:13:35,130 --> 00:13:38,080
Everybody was dressed up, ripped up.
309
00:13:38,100 --> 00:13:40,170
Nobody wanted to look like one another.
310
00:13:40,190 --> 00:13:41,230
They did their utmost
311
00:13:42,010 --> 00:13:45,210
to actually look completely different.
312
00:13:53,050 --> 00:13:55,120
[♪♪♪]
313
00:13:57,150 --> 00:14:00,020
Clothing was a big thing
in the punk movement.
314
00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:01,090
There was an explosion of craziness.
315
00:14:01,110 --> 00:14:02,986
You'd see all kinds of colors
and different things.
316
00:14:03,010 --> 00:14:05,000
That wasn't my particular thing,
317
00:14:05,020 --> 00:14:07,150
but a lot of guys would go
down to all these shops.
318
00:14:07,170 --> 00:14:09,070
I was more into the music.
319
00:14:10,090 --> 00:14:13,060
Well, Mick knew everything
about rock and roll.
320
00:14:13,080 --> 00:14:15,130
He was like an encyclopedia of rock,
321
00:14:15,150 --> 00:14:17,000
and knew who was who, and what was rock.
322
00:14:17,020 --> 00:14:19,100
Then you had Paul
that only listened to reggae,
323
00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:22,060
and Joe listened to all kinds
of weird and wonderful stuff,
324
00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:24,050
and I was into hard rock at the time,
325
00:14:24,070 --> 00:14:26,130
so it was a melting pot,
really, of different things.
326
00:14:26,150 --> 00:14:28,030
Well, the way we see it, like,
this is like,
327
00:14:28,050 --> 00:14:30,040
you start up, and you go,
"We're The Clash,
328
00:14:30,060 --> 00:14:31,210
and we got something to say."
329
00:14:31,230 --> 00:14:33,170
[Chimes]: I was
talking to Joe about this,
330
00:14:33,190 --> 00:14:36,030
and he was explaining to me
that the rock bands of the day,
331
00:14:36,050 --> 00:14:37,370
their music's all about nonsense,
332
00:14:38,010 --> 00:14:39,050
irrelevant nonsense,
333
00:14:39,070 --> 00:14:42,020
whereas these reggae bands
talk about real-life things
334
00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:43,020
that affect them.
335
00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:44,100
That was why he liked reggae.
336
00:14:44,120 --> 00:14:47,010
[♪♪♪]
337
00:14:47,030 --> 00:14:49,020
[Letts]: One of the most
interesting things
338
00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:50,160
about the UK punk scene
339
00:14:50,180 --> 00:14:53,170
was their love of Jamaican music.
340
00:14:53,190 --> 00:14:55,120
You know, that gave the English thing
341
00:14:55,140 --> 00:14:57,020
a slightly different angle
342
00:14:57,040 --> 00:14:58,160
to what was going on,
343
00:14:58,180 --> 00:15:01,020
which was straight-up Caucasian shit,
344
00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:02,070
stateside.
345
00:15:02,090 --> 00:15:06,060
Over here, people like
John Lydon and The Clash guys,
346
00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:08,030
they were embracing the musical lessons
347
00:15:08,050 --> 00:15:11,110
that they had heard from Jamaican music.
348
00:15:11,130 --> 00:15:14,170
There was this
cross-fertilization of ideas
349
00:15:14,190 --> 00:15:17,130
where we were actually
turning each other on
350
00:15:17,150 --> 00:15:20,070
through our respective cultures.
351
00:15:20,090 --> 00:15:21,220
As far as I was concerned,
352
00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:24,210
the punk scene wasn't inclusive
at the beginning.
353
00:15:24,230 --> 00:15:27,040
It was something that developed in time.
354
00:15:28,100 --> 00:15:30,190
The Clash were very instrumental
355
00:15:30,210 --> 00:15:32,160
in taking the reggae sound
356
00:15:32,180 --> 00:15:35,040
and mixing it with a rock sound
357
00:15:35,060 --> 00:15:37,150
that could actually cross over
358
00:15:37,170 --> 00:15:42,030
into both young black people
and young white people.
359
00:15:42,050 --> 00:15:44,180
It just seemed all so exciting,
360
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:46,110
and for that,
361
00:15:46,130 --> 00:15:49,200
I have undying respect for Joe Strummer.
362
00:15:49,220 --> 00:15:51,070
[♪♪♪]
363
00:15:51,090 --> 00:15:52,150
[Chimes]: Joe felt
364
00:15:52,170 --> 00:15:54,090
that the song should be about
something worth singing about
365
00:15:54,110 --> 00:15:56,150
rather than tra-la-la-la-la.
366
00:15:56,170 --> 00:15:58,250
It should be something...
a message worth giving out.
367
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,090
I didn't care about politics at all.
368
00:16:01,110 --> 00:16:02,200
I think most drummers are like that.
369
00:16:02,220 --> 00:16:04,050
If you ask them,
they don't care about that.
370
00:16:04,070 --> 00:16:05,180
They want to get on the stage
and play music,
371
00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:07,070
but Joe cared very deeply about it,
372
00:16:07,090 --> 00:16:10,040
and everyone else was
more or less on side with that.
373
00:16:10,060 --> 00:16:11,190
That aspect of The Clash,
374
00:16:11,210 --> 00:16:13,050
you know, being so political,
375
00:16:13,070 --> 00:16:15,150
being so vocal
about things that they saw,
376
00:16:15,170 --> 00:16:17,060
was really down to Joe Strummer.
377
00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:19,140
It's no secret
he was the son of a diplomat,
378
00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:21,040
traveled a lot as a youth,
379
00:16:21,060 --> 00:16:25,090
and he had this great empathy
towards his fellow human being,
380
00:16:25,110 --> 00:16:28,210
and he believed in music
as a tool for social change.
381
00:16:28,230 --> 00:16:30,100
Yeah, I think you definitely can change.
382
00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:32,060
I mean, look at the '60s, you know.
383
00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:34,210
What do you remember from the '60s?
384
00:16:34,230 --> 00:16:35,190
Right?
385
00:16:35,210 --> 00:16:37,100
All I can remember was the music.
386
00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:39,160
Music is what people are turning onto
387
00:16:39,180 --> 00:16:42,130
in this last 30, 40 years,
388
00:16:42,150 --> 00:16:44,140
not books or art,
389
00:16:44,160 --> 00:16:46,140
and so we've got more chance
than anybody
390
00:16:46,160 --> 00:16:48,040
to change things, you know?
391
00:16:48,060 --> 00:16:49,100
I mean, it's all too easy
392
00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:51,160
just to say, "No,
it doesn't change anything."
393
00:16:51,180 --> 00:16:53,220
[Chimes]: We'd been
rehearsing forever.
394
00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:56,080
It felt like years.
395
00:16:56,100 --> 00:16:57,200
So we were clamoring to get on stage
396
00:16:57,220 --> 00:16:59,150
and do a gig,
397
00:16:59,170 --> 00:17:02,140
and the first gig we ever did
was in Sheffield,
398
00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:04,100
which is a hell of a way from London.
399
00:17:04,120 --> 00:17:07,020
We got up at silly o'clock
in the morning,
400
00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:08,020
and drove there in the dark,
401
00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:09,170
and got there about eight hours early
402
00:17:09,190 --> 00:17:12,040
because we were so desperate
to do our first show.
403
00:17:12,060 --> 00:17:13,190
So we got there
and just hung around all day,
404
00:17:13,210 --> 00:17:15,020
waiting for the show,
405
00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:17,050
and, um, we played our show,
406
00:17:17,070 --> 00:17:18,976
which wasn't great,
I don't think, as a first one,
407
00:17:19,000 --> 00:17:20,200
but your first one's
never going to be perfect,
408
00:17:20,220 --> 00:17:22,100
but it was okay,
409
00:17:22,120 --> 00:17:23,130
and then we sat there
410
00:17:23,150 --> 00:17:25,160
and watched the Pistols do their show,
411
00:17:25,180 --> 00:17:29,030
because all our first gigs
were supporting them.
412
00:17:29,050 --> 00:17:31,150
I sat with Joe and watched it.
413
00:17:31,170 --> 00:17:33,060
They'd been playing for quite a while,
414
00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:35,150
so they were
a well-oiled machine by then.
415
00:17:35,170 --> 00:17:37,010
It was kind of a moment, really,
416
00:17:37,030 --> 00:17:40,030
when Joe and I thought,
"Yeah, this... this is working,
417
00:17:40,050 --> 00:17:41,120
and we can do this as well."
418
00:17:41,140 --> 00:17:43,040
All right, cool it.
419
00:17:43,060 --> 00:17:46,110
Simmer down, control your temper.
420
00:17:46,130 --> 00:17:48,010
[microphone feedback]
421
00:17:48,030 --> 00:17:50,200
We've still got another
fucking song to do yet.
422
00:17:50,220 --> 00:17:53,160
It's been a while
since I've got a vinyl disc
423
00:17:53,180 --> 00:17:54,180
on the turntable.
424
00:17:59,210 --> 00:18:02,090
All right, here we go.
425
00:18:02,110 --> 00:18:05,020
[♪♪♪]
426
00:18:13,060 --> 00:18:15,000
Tune sounds good.
427
00:18:15,020 --> 00:18:16,070
[♪♪♪]
428
00:18:16,090 --> 00:18:18,190
♪ Yankee soldier ♪
429
00:18:18,210 --> 00:18:21,040
♪ He want to shoot some skag ♪
430
00:18:21,060 --> 00:18:23,070
♪ He met it in Cambodia ♪
431
00:18:23,090 --> 00:18:25,200
♪ But now
he can't afford a bag ♪
432
00:18:25,220 --> 00:18:28,150
♪ Yankee dollar talk ♪
433
00:18:28,170 --> 00:18:30,020
♪ To the dictators
of the world... ♪
434
00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:31,180
It's political, but it's catchy.
435
00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,050
It has a melody,
436
00:18:33,070 --> 00:18:35,170
and that's what I like about it too.
437
00:18:35,190 --> 00:18:38,000
♪ I'm so bored ♪
438
00:18:38,020 --> 00:18:40,180
♪ With the U.S.A. ♪
439
00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:43,020
♪ I'm so bored ♪
440
00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:45,150
♪ With the U.S.A. ♪
441
00:18:45,170 --> 00:18:49,230
♪ I'm so bored
with the U.S.A. ♪
442
00:18:50,010 --> 00:18:51,160
♪ But what can I do? ♪
443
00:18:51,180 --> 00:18:54,210
[Joan Jett]: When The Runaways
went to England in 1976,
444
00:18:54,230 --> 00:18:56,190
I saw a Clash show,
445
00:18:56,210 --> 00:19:00,010
and I went over
dressed kind of as a glam kid,
446
00:19:00,030 --> 00:19:02,120
came back dressed as a punk.
447
00:19:02,140 --> 00:19:05,030
Seeing the kids in the audiences,
448
00:19:05,050 --> 00:19:07,170
it was definitely life-changing.
449
00:19:07,190 --> 00:19:10,120
Even if you don't think
The Runaways' music was punk,
450
00:19:10,140 --> 00:19:11,180
which I don't, necessarily,
451
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:15,170
the idea of girls playing rock 'n' roll,
452
00:19:15,190 --> 00:19:16,210
and doing it,
453
00:19:16,230 --> 00:19:18,230
that's as punk as you get.
454
00:19:19,010 --> 00:19:21,230
[♪♪♪]
455
00:19:22,010 --> 00:19:24,090
♪ Blue-skinned sleeping boys ♪
456
00:19:24,110 --> 00:19:28,030
♪ Man, you're looking wasted ♪
457
00:19:28,050 --> 00:19:29,170
♪ Greasy wheels ♪
458
00:19:29,190 --> 00:19:31,050
♪ Streets of steel ♪
459
00:19:31,070 --> 00:19:34,210
♪ No tellin' what you tasted ♪
460
00:19:34,230 --> 00:19:37,200
♪ Good guys, bad guys... ♪
461
00:19:37,220 --> 00:19:39,010
[Jett]:
Rock 'n' roll is sexual,
462
00:19:39,030 --> 00:19:40,150
and that's why people have a problem
463
00:19:40,170 --> 00:19:41,490
with girls playing rock 'n' roll,
464
00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:43,140
because basically
you're saying, "Okay, well,
465
00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:44,360
girls have to talk about sex,"
466
00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:46,190
and people are uncomfortable with that,
467
00:19:46,210 --> 00:19:49,100
and once you put on the guitar,
yeah, I mean...
468
00:19:49,120 --> 00:19:51,020
[♪♪♪]
469
00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:52,080
I really feel it.
470
00:19:52,100 --> 00:19:55,200
My crotch is up against the wood.
471
00:19:55,220 --> 00:19:57,030
Pussy to the wood.
472
00:19:57,050 --> 00:19:59,210
[♪♪♪]
473
00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:03,140
Coming from a female perspective,
474
00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:05,000
it's very sensual.
475
00:20:05,020 --> 00:20:06,120
Not just sexual.
476
00:20:06,140 --> 00:20:08,140
It's just a full body thing,
477
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:11,030
and I'm sure people know
what I'm talking about.
478
00:20:11,050 --> 00:20:13,170
When you hear a certain sound,
479
00:20:13,190 --> 00:20:18,020
you just go, "Oh, god."
480
00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:20,090
[♪♪♪]
481
00:20:28,170 --> 00:20:32,130
[Albertine]: The only girls
I'd ever seen play guitar
482
00:20:32,150 --> 00:20:35,080
were the band Fanny
and the band The Runaways,
483
00:20:35,100 --> 00:20:38,040
who felt maybe a bit glamorous,
484
00:20:38,060 --> 00:20:39,060
but those two bands
485
00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:41,080
didn't make me feel
like I could do that.
486
00:20:41,100 --> 00:20:43,150
It wasn't until I saw the Sex Pistols,
487
00:20:43,170 --> 00:20:44,190
North London boys,
488
00:20:44,210 --> 00:20:45,200
badly educated,
489
00:20:45,220 --> 00:20:48,120
not trying to be glamorous.
490
00:20:48,140 --> 00:20:52,070
They were just this bunch
of ordinary failures
491
00:20:52,090 --> 00:20:54,170
and ragamuffins from the street.
492
00:20:54,190 --> 00:20:56,120
Even though they were boys,
493
00:20:56,140 --> 00:20:59,020
that made me think,
"I'm going to pick up a guitar.
494
00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:00,190
I don't care if I can't sing,
can't play,"
495
00:21:00,210 --> 00:21:03,010
and I think that was
a real advantage of the Slits.
496
00:21:03,030 --> 00:21:04,160
We made it up as we went along.
497
00:21:04,180 --> 00:21:08,000
We started, you know, at ground zero
498
00:21:08,020 --> 00:21:09,050
and built it from there.
499
00:21:09,070 --> 00:21:12,010
♪ Vindictive, aggressive,
that's all you can be ♪
500
00:21:12,030 --> 00:21:14,220
♪ Vindictive, aggressive,
don't try it on me ♪
501
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:17,190
♪ You're wasting your words
don't expect it from me ♪
502
00:21:17,210 --> 00:21:22,050
♪ I know that it hurts
but my love died quickly ♪
503
00:21:22,070 --> 00:21:24,220
♪ Vindictive, aggressive,
that's all you can be ♪
504
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:27,190
♪ Vindictive, aggressive,
don't try it on me ♪
505
00:21:27,210 --> 00:21:30,130
♪ You're wasting your words
don't expect anything ♪
506
00:21:30,150 --> 00:21:31,150
[Palmolive]: There we were,
507
00:21:31,170 --> 00:21:33,170
four crazy girls,
508
00:21:33,190 --> 00:21:35,230
and we managed to come together
509
00:21:36,010 --> 00:21:37,160
and put these songs together.
510
00:21:37,180 --> 00:21:39,140
Now, we didn't know
how to play, neither,
511
00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:41,070
so many of the times,
512
00:21:41,090 --> 00:21:43,200
we were playing different songs.
513
00:21:43,220 --> 00:21:44,620
I thought we were playing that one,
514
00:21:45,010 --> 00:21:45,220
and we were playing...
515
00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:48,200
But it was this chaotic,
516
00:21:48,220 --> 00:21:50,180
beautiful noise,
517
00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:52,010
and people were into it.
518
00:21:52,030 --> 00:21:53,130
[♪♪♪]
519
00:21:53,150 --> 00:21:55,230
[Rotten]:
Them all-girl bands,
520
00:21:56,010 --> 00:21:59,160
they could take us to the cleaners,
521
00:21:59,180 --> 00:22:01,030
some of them bands,
522
00:22:01,050 --> 00:22:03,090
if they really wanted to,
523
00:22:03,110 --> 00:22:05,120
and that was so excellent.
524
00:22:05,140 --> 00:22:07,080
I remember all of them.
525
00:22:07,100 --> 00:22:08,210
They trace back,
526
00:22:08,230 --> 00:22:11,190
but the Slits were a phenomenon.
527
00:22:11,210 --> 00:22:14,010
[♪♪♪]
528
00:22:14,030 --> 00:22:15,150
♪ Don't know what to say ♪
529
00:22:15,170 --> 00:22:18,180
We were definitely very provocative,
530
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:21,160
but we felt it was our right
to be provocative.
531
00:22:21,180 --> 00:22:24,180
That didn't give someone
the right to punch you
532
00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,150
or cut a slit on your pants
with a knife...
533
00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,140
but there was violence.
534
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,020
We got assaulted.
535
00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:35,080
I got punched on my eye one time.
536
00:22:35,100 --> 00:22:38,010
This guy was just so mad,
537
00:22:38,030 --> 00:22:39,010
basically mad,
538
00:22:39,030 --> 00:22:40,170
and I said,
"Okay, you're out of here."
539
00:22:40,190 --> 00:22:44,010
♪ Let's do the split
and I'll shit on it ♪
540
00:22:44,030 --> 00:22:45,110
♪ Let's do the split ♪
541
00:22:45,130 --> 00:22:46,160
♪ And I'll spit on it ♪
542
00:22:46,180 --> 00:22:49,060
It's fuckin' useless.
543
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,070
It's crap.
544
00:22:52,190 --> 00:22:54,020
[Palmolive]: You know,
I feel like in a way,
545
00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:58,230
the Slits, we were a revolution
within the revolution.
546
00:22:59,010 --> 00:23:02,170
We wanted to have
the reins of our destiny.
547
00:23:02,190 --> 00:23:04,030
The gender neutrality,
548
00:23:04,050 --> 00:23:06,000
the gender balance that was
happening in punk rock
549
00:23:06,020 --> 00:23:08,000
was really significant at that time.
550
00:23:08,020 --> 00:23:10,150
It wasn't a boy's music,
it wasn't a girl's music.
551
00:23:10,170 --> 00:23:11,170
There were bully boys
552
00:23:11,190 --> 00:23:14,120
who still had this way
of looking at women
553
00:23:14,140 --> 00:23:17,190
as a lesser proposition
in what they were doing,
554
00:23:17,210 --> 00:23:19,130
but that's because they were idiots.
555
00:23:19,150 --> 00:23:23,070
The most powerful players
in punk rock were female.
556
00:23:23,090 --> 00:23:24,130
It was Patti Smith, it was Debbie Harry,
557
00:23:24,150 --> 00:23:25,190
it was Siouxsie Sioux.
558
00:23:28,100 --> 00:23:30,040
[Debbie Harry]: We were
trying to find our niche.
559
00:23:30,060 --> 00:23:32,060
I mean, I was a girl singer,
560
00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:35,080
and the Ramones actually really
appreciated the fact
561
00:23:35,100 --> 00:23:37,210
that I came out of a real girl group,
562
00:23:37,230 --> 00:23:39,120
Randamp;B kind of thinking,
563
00:23:39,140 --> 00:23:41,000
or sound.
564
00:23:41,020 --> 00:23:42,020
Debbie is the only female
565
00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:44,030
on a Ramones record.
566
00:23:44,050 --> 00:23:46,180
She sings on Little Camaro.
567
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:47,180
Go, little Camaro.
568
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:49,040
Go, Lil' Camaro, Go.
569
00:23:49,060 --> 00:23:51,160
and it was about my car,
because I had a Camaro.
570
00:23:51,180 --> 00:23:55,010
I think I almost ran
one of them down one night,
571
00:23:55,030 --> 00:23:57,080
and that's when they took me seriously.
572
00:23:57,100 --> 00:23:58,070
Maybe.
573
00:23:58,090 --> 00:23:59,230
[laughs]
574
00:24:01,220 --> 00:24:05,060
[Rotten]: Women had never
been allowed that opportunity
575
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:06,170
up until punk rock,
576
00:24:06,190 --> 00:24:10,160
and, wow, did they have
a story to tell...
577
00:24:10,180 --> 00:24:13,010
Possibly a more interesting story
578
00:24:13,030 --> 00:24:15,130
than any of the moldy old men,
579
00:24:15,150 --> 00:24:17,070
including myself.
580
00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:20,000
[Albertine]:
It wasn't like
581
00:24:20,020 --> 00:24:21,210
they were an enlightened
bunch of punk men
582
00:24:21,230 --> 00:24:23,030
who said,
"We'll let women in."
583
00:24:23,050 --> 00:24:24,070
No, us girls,
584
00:24:24,090 --> 00:24:26,210
us Slits, we booted our way in.
585
00:24:26,230 --> 00:24:30,080
Our first gig, we went to a pub,
586
00:24:30,100 --> 00:24:31,110
and there were a bunch of boys
playing there.
587
00:24:31,130 --> 00:24:32,130
We jumped up on stage.
588
00:24:32,150 --> 00:24:33,210
We pulled their leads out,
589
00:24:33,230 --> 00:24:35,090
plugged our guitars and our leads in,
590
00:24:35,110 --> 00:24:37,590
and we got through half a song
before they pulled us off stage.
591
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:44,090
That is the epitome
of how the Slits made their way
592
00:24:44,110 --> 00:24:46,010
into something that's now called punk.
593
00:24:46,030 --> 00:24:47,180
[♪♪♪]
594
00:24:52,190 --> 00:24:55,170
When the group of us
started to get together,
595
00:24:55,190 --> 00:24:57,090
you know, I was entering an industry
596
00:24:57,110 --> 00:25:01,170
which was made up of virtuosos
in the '60s and '70s,
597
00:25:01,190 --> 00:25:03,060
people who'd been playing for years,
598
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,180
could do really fast
guitar solos, you know,
599
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,000
learned music since the age
of god knows what,
600
00:25:08,020 --> 00:25:10,090
but the Ramones were minimal.
601
00:25:10,110 --> 00:25:12,010
You know, there were no guitar solos.
602
00:25:12,030 --> 00:25:13,110
Every song was short.
603
00:25:13,130 --> 00:25:15,060
We were absolutely enthralled,
604
00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:19,190
and we couldn't wait for them
to come over to Britain.
605
00:25:22,020 --> 00:25:24,220
[♪♪♪]
606
00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:32,010
[Legs McNeil]: At the time,
607
00:25:32,030 --> 00:25:33,010
no one was listening to the Ramones,
608
00:25:33,030 --> 00:25:34,180
and nobody wanted them.
609
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:36,220
No one wanted punk in America.
610
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:38,020
It didn't sell,
611
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:41,010
except for maybe 200 people
612
00:25:41,030 --> 00:25:44,080
that hung out at CBGBs and Max's.
613
00:25:44,100 --> 00:25:46,230
I mean, the Ramones
could not get a break
614
00:25:47,010 --> 00:25:48,070
beyond that circuit,
615
00:25:48,090 --> 00:25:50,190
so Linda Stein said to Danny,
616
00:25:50,210 --> 00:25:53,140
"I think we should try to get
the Ramones some exposure
617
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:54,230
in England,"
618
00:25:55,010 --> 00:25:58,040
and they played
on the 4th of July, 1976,
619
00:25:58,060 --> 00:25:59,210
in London.
620
00:25:59,230 --> 00:26:03,150
That show broke punk in England,
621
00:26:03,170 --> 00:26:05,190
because the Ramones were the band
622
00:26:05,210 --> 00:26:09,020
that everyone was trying
to copy in England.
623
00:26:11,010 --> 00:26:12,100
[Vanian]: The Ramones gig,
624
00:26:12,120 --> 00:26:14,030
you had, you know, everybody there
625
00:26:14,050 --> 00:26:16,060
from the Buzzcocks, the Vibrators,
626
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,190
Billy Idol, you know, Gen X, The Damned.
627
00:26:19,210 --> 00:26:21,200
We were all in those front two rows.
628
00:26:23,050 --> 00:26:25,190
It was just this massive wall of sound
629
00:26:25,210 --> 00:26:27,090
that had this really exciting way
630
00:26:27,110 --> 00:26:29,110
of it being for you, you know.
631
00:26:29,130 --> 00:26:30,530
It was suddenly right in your face,
632
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:32,140
and it was these young kids
in leather jackets
633
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:33,120
going for it.
634
00:26:33,140 --> 00:26:35,140
They were so extreme, the Ramones,
635
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:39,050
and punk in Britain
was aiming to be extreme,
636
00:26:39,070 --> 00:26:41,010
and I think they were
the sort of pinnacle
637
00:26:41,030 --> 00:26:42,040
for many of us,
638
00:26:42,060 --> 00:26:43,200
especially the guys.
639
00:26:43,220 --> 00:26:45,200
The guys absolutely loved the Ramones.
640
00:26:45,220 --> 00:26:46,200
It was huge,
641
00:26:46,220 --> 00:26:48,030
especially for Sid Vicious.
642
00:26:48,050 --> 00:26:49,160
They were his favorite band
in the world.
643
00:26:49,180 --> 00:26:53,090
They were absolutely
the epitome of punk for him.
644
00:26:53,110 --> 00:26:55,120
[Marky Ramone]: I knew
they loved the Ramones.
645
00:26:55,140 --> 00:26:56,260
The "One, two, three, four,"
646
00:26:57,010 --> 00:26:58,200
and then, you know, they put on
the leather jackets,
647
00:26:58,220 --> 00:27:01,040
and the Converse sneakers,
648
00:27:01,060 --> 00:27:03,000
and the jeans and all that,
649
00:27:03,020 --> 00:27:04,060
and the pins,
650
00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:06,070
which the Ramones started,
651
00:27:06,090 --> 00:27:08,200
but they had their own thing going.
652
00:27:09,190 --> 00:27:11,010
We were American.
653
00:27:11,030 --> 00:27:11,230
We weren't English.
654
00:27:12,010 --> 00:27:13,190
It was two different things.
655
00:27:13,210 --> 00:27:18,220
The American punk rock
was more about having fun,
656
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:20,100
doing what you like,
657
00:27:20,120 --> 00:27:23,020
and not getting so heavily involved
658
00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:24,210
with the political situation.
659
00:27:24,230 --> 00:27:26,210
The English were more political.
660
00:27:26,230 --> 00:27:28,190
We were more about fun.
661
00:27:28,210 --> 00:27:31,170
[♪♪♪]
662
00:27:34,150 --> 00:27:37,150
♪ Twenty-twenty-twenty-four
hours to go ♪
663
00:27:37,170 --> 00:27:40,060
♪ I wanna be sedated ♪
664
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,110
♪ Nothing to do
nowhere to go-oh ♪
665
00:27:43,130 --> 00:27:45,220
♪ I wanna be sedated ♪
666
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:47,150
♪ Just get me to the airport ♪
667
00:27:47,170 --> 00:27:49,020
♪ Put me on a plane ♪
668
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:50,190
♪ Hurry, hurry, hurry... ♪
669
00:27:50,210 --> 00:27:53,020
The experience of spitting
in the UK was gross,
670
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:57,180
but it was sign
of affection for the band.
671
00:27:57,200 --> 00:27:59,030
The more you spit,
672
00:27:59,050 --> 00:28:01,060
that meant the more they liked you,
673
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,150
so that's why there was always
a lot of beer around.
674
00:28:03,170 --> 00:28:06,050
You just have some beer in your mouth,
675
00:28:06,070 --> 00:28:07,070
just spit the beer out.
676
00:28:07,090 --> 00:28:08,180
I was the drummer,
677
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:10,050
so I was kind of in the back,
678
00:28:10,070 --> 00:28:12,010
so I didn't get hit that often,
679
00:28:12,030 --> 00:28:14,020
but when it sprayed
off my cymbal, the beer,
680
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:15,150
and it went into my mouth,
681
00:28:15,170 --> 00:28:16,130
I liked it.
682
00:28:16,150 --> 00:28:17,150
[laughs]
683
00:28:17,170 --> 00:28:21,060
You know, I couldn't wait
to have a beer afterward.
684
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:23,130
[♪♪♪]
685
00:28:23,150 --> 00:28:24,120
In England,
686
00:28:24,140 --> 00:28:26,110
when the kids watch the punk bands,
687
00:28:26,130 --> 00:28:27,200
they spit at the performers,
688
00:28:27,220 --> 00:28:29,060
and that's their show of affection,
689
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:31,030
which the band themselves
don't particularly care for.
690
00:28:31,050 --> 00:28:33,070
I don't know where that came from.
691
00:28:33,090 --> 00:28:34,210
I never really understood it,
692
00:28:34,230 --> 00:28:37,110
because, you know,
who wants to stand there
693
00:28:37,130 --> 00:28:39,190
being showered in spittle?
694
00:28:39,210 --> 00:28:41,110
Nobody.
695
00:28:41,130 --> 00:28:44,150
But it did become
part of that thing, and I...
696
00:28:44,170 --> 00:28:46,080
Yeah, I hated it personally,
697
00:28:46,100 --> 00:28:49,070
but I dealt with it, shall we say.
698
00:28:49,090 --> 00:28:53,070
Where they came up with
the idea of spitting on me
699
00:28:53,090 --> 00:28:55,150
or at me,
700
00:28:55,170 --> 00:28:58,220
I can only really
blame newspapers at that time
701
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:02,110
for implying that
that was the situation.
702
00:29:02,130 --> 00:29:04,200
It really wasn't.
703
00:29:04,220 --> 00:29:09,120
To spit at me, I take, to this day,
704
00:29:09,140 --> 00:29:13,070
as an offense of the highest order.
705
00:29:13,090 --> 00:29:17,010
I do not want your diseases.
706
00:29:19,030 --> 00:29:20,150
Now, where were we?
707
00:29:20,170 --> 00:29:23,150
Yeah...
Oh, the Ramones.
708
00:29:23,170 --> 00:29:25,130
The major lie
709
00:29:25,150 --> 00:29:30,140
about the Ramones helping us
form as a band,
710
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:31,170
the Sex Pistols,
711
00:29:31,190 --> 00:29:34,230
is that we already were a band.
712
00:29:35,010 --> 00:29:36,050
Right?
713
00:29:36,070 --> 00:29:39,120
It's really,
really difficult and annoying
714
00:29:39,140 --> 00:29:43,230
that every time you try
to do something honest,
715
00:29:44,010 --> 00:29:48,060
it gets misinterpreted via journalism,
716
00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:50,050
one way or another.
717
00:29:50,070 --> 00:29:52,160
It's very upsetting.
718
00:29:52,180 --> 00:29:55,090
Here's the major answer to it.
719
00:29:55,110 --> 00:29:58,090
Listen to a Ramones record,
720
00:29:58,110 --> 00:30:02,030
then listen to a Sex Pistols record.
721
00:30:02,050 --> 00:30:04,160
Spot the difference.
722
00:30:04,180 --> 00:30:06,170
That's all you gotta do.
723
00:30:08,190 --> 00:30:12,010
[record changer clicks]
724
00:30:12,030 --> 00:30:13,210
[record drops]
725
00:30:13,230 --> 00:30:17,230
[♪♪♪]
726
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:20,170
[mouthing along with recording]
♪ Right... ♪
727
00:30:20,190 --> 00:30:23,000
♪ ...now! ♪
728
00:30:23,020 --> 00:30:25,020
♪ Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha... ♪
729
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:26,070
It's such a good song.
730
00:30:26,090 --> 00:30:28,120
[♪♪♪]
731
00:30:28,140 --> 00:30:31,200
♪ I am an antichrist ♪
732
00:30:31,220 --> 00:30:35,030
♪ I am an anarchist ♪
733
00:30:35,050 --> 00:30:37,000
♪ Don't know what I want ♪
734
00:30:37,020 --> 00:30:39,020
♪ But I know how to get it ♪
735
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:42,060
♪ I want to destroy
the passerby ♪
736
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:45,140
♪ Because I ♪
737
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:48,210
♪ Wanna be anarchy... ♪
738
00:30:48,230 --> 00:30:52,120
The Sex Pistols forced music to change,
739
00:30:52,140 --> 00:30:53,180
radio to change.
740
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:55,210
♪ No dogsbody... ♪
741
00:30:55,230 --> 00:30:58,060
That band was the shot
heard around the world.
742
00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:00,100
♪ Anarchy for the UK ♪
743
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,210
♪ It's coming sometime
and maybe... ♪
744
00:31:03,230 --> 00:31:06,040
[Ramone]:
What they were singing about,
745
00:31:06,060 --> 00:31:09,050
a lot of Americans
probably wouldn't understand,
746
00:31:09,070 --> 00:31:10,220
but we liked the music.
747
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:13,220
♪ Because I ♪
748
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,190
♪ I wanna be anarchy... ♪
749
00:31:16,210 --> 00:31:18,140
[Rotten]:
Songs about anarchy are just,
750
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:22,060
they're vital to my very existence.
751
00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:26,110
They absolutely have to be
written and put down.
752
00:31:26,130 --> 00:31:29,120
[♪♪♪]
753
00:31:31,130 --> 00:31:35,080
Nobody stood up and said anything at all
754
00:31:35,100 --> 00:31:36,160
about the Royal Family.
755
00:31:36,180 --> 00:31:38,060
It was sacrosanct.
756
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,210
[♪♪♪]
757
00:31:40,230 --> 00:31:44,180
Amazing that people will try to ignore
758
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:48,080
how we changed Britain overnight really
759
00:31:48,100 --> 00:31:50,130
with that record.
760
00:31:50,150 --> 00:31:53,050
It was quite astounding.
761
00:31:53,070 --> 00:31:55,060
♪ I use anarchy ♪
762
00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:58,160
♪ 'Cause I ♪
763
00:31:58,180 --> 00:32:01,000
♪ Wanna be ♪
764
00:32:01,020 --> 00:32:05,120
♪ An anarchist ♪
765
00:32:05,140 --> 00:32:07,140
♪ I get pissed ♪
766
00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:12,200
♪ Destroy! ♪
767
00:32:12,220 --> 00:32:14,170
[song ends]
768
00:32:14,190 --> 00:32:16,020
[cheering]
769
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:19,060
[interval between songs playing]
770
00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,040
[vinyl crackling]
771
00:32:21,060 --> 00:32:23,080
Well, it's all right, innit?
772
00:32:23,100 --> 00:32:24,040
You know?
773
00:32:24,060 --> 00:32:30,160
[bagpipe plays]
774
00:32:30,180 --> 00:32:34,040
[applause]
775
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:43,210
[Vanian]: I think
there was a backlash
776
00:32:43,230 --> 00:32:46,220
against the Royal Family at that time
777
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:49,040
because, you know, as I said,
times were hard for everybody,
778
00:32:49,060 --> 00:32:52,050
and then you're trying
to make ends meet,
779
00:32:52,070 --> 00:32:54,120
and there's the Queen with everything.
780
00:32:54,140 --> 00:32:56,200
[bagpipe playing]
781
00:32:56,220 --> 00:32:58,010
[Chimes]:
In London at that time,
782
00:32:58,030 --> 00:33:00,040
there was a lot of political unrest.
783
00:33:00,060 --> 00:33:01,860
People were unhappy
and angry with each other.
784
00:33:03,150 --> 00:33:06,170
To me, punk is the challenge
that our generation threw out,
785
00:33:06,190 --> 00:33:08,230
saying, "We're not going
to have this status quo.
786
00:33:09,010 --> 00:33:12,110
We're going to create something
where we do things ourselves
787
00:33:12,130 --> 00:33:14,120
which are accessible
to the world."
788
00:33:17,190 --> 00:33:18,986
[Rotten]: This is why I like
terms like "punk."
789
00:33:19,010 --> 00:33:21,120
"What does that mean?"
790
00:33:21,140 --> 00:33:22,100
"I don't know."
791
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:24,060
So I go home to my dictionary,
792
00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,160
and I find out that "punk"
is Mr. Big's toy boy
793
00:33:27,180 --> 00:33:30,140
in an American prison system.
794
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:34,120
Well, I'm afraid
I don't quite fit that agenda,
795
00:33:34,140 --> 00:33:38,000
but somehow the term stuck...
796
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:42,030
but what's really important to me
797
00:33:42,050 --> 00:33:43,220
is what punk turned into.
798
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:47,000
Honesty, originality,
799
00:33:47,020 --> 00:33:50,110
and a genuine feel
for my fellow human beings.
800
00:33:50,130 --> 00:33:53,100
I think the word is "empathy," really,
801
00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:54,210
and there it is,
802
00:33:54,230 --> 00:33:56,160
and then punk took off.
803
00:33:56,180 --> 00:33:59,200
[♪♪♪]
804
00:34:00,170 --> 00:34:01,200
[Vanian]: Weirdly enough,
805
00:34:01,220 --> 00:34:04,160
The Damned were the first band
of that first group
806
00:34:04,180 --> 00:34:06,050
to go out and tour,
807
00:34:06,070 --> 00:34:08,210
and then the Anarchy tour came along,
808
00:34:08,230 --> 00:34:10,020
and that was an amazing line-up,
809
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:12,030
because you had us,
you had the Sex Pistols,
810
00:34:12,050 --> 00:34:13,060
you had The Clash,
811
00:34:13,080 --> 00:34:15,210
you had Johnny Thunders
and the Heartbreakers,
812
00:34:15,230 --> 00:34:17,110
and you had Wayne County, too.
813
00:34:17,130 --> 00:34:20,090
It was an incredible bill
of the best bands, really.
814
00:34:20,110 --> 00:34:23,080
So when we were rehearsing for the show,
815
00:34:23,100 --> 00:34:26,100
the Sex Pistols went to do
the Grundy TV show,
816
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:28,190
and it's amazing
that it actually went out.
817
00:34:28,210 --> 00:34:30,040
I suppose if it hadn't gone out live,
818
00:34:30,060 --> 00:34:32,090
it never would have
gone out at all, but...
819
00:34:32,110 --> 00:34:34,010
there you go.
820
00:34:34,030 --> 00:34:36,050
Punk, the new craze, they tell me.
821
00:34:36,070 --> 00:34:37,090
Their heroes,
822
00:34:37,110 --> 00:34:40,110
not the nice, clean Rolling Stones.
823
00:34:40,130 --> 00:34:42,030
You see, they are as drunk as I am.
824
00:34:42,050 --> 00:34:43,170
They are clean by comparison.
825
00:34:43,190 --> 00:34:45,210
They are a group called the Sex Pistols.
826
00:34:47,090 --> 00:34:50,140
The Bill Grundy interview.
827
00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:54,000
Wow, that was an odd one.
828
00:34:54,020 --> 00:34:56,090
Queen had canceled an interview.
829
00:34:56,110 --> 00:35:01,020
Would we rush over to do it
as a replacement?
830
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:04,170
Of course, Malcolm's thinking,
"Oh, this would be great.
831
00:35:04,190 --> 00:35:05,230
Oh, oh.
832
00:35:06,010 --> 00:35:07,040
Imagine the...
833
00:35:07,060 --> 00:35:08,100
[whines derisively]
834
00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:11,170
...the chance to promote
your new single."
835
00:35:11,190 --> 00:35:13,200
That's my best Malcolm impersonation.
836
00:35:13,220 --> 00:35:17,040
I am told that that group
837
00:35:17,060 --> 00:35:20,060
received 40,000 pounds
from a record company.
838
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:22,210
Doesn't that seem to be slightly opposed
839
00:35:22,230 --> 00:35:25,110
to the anti-materialistic view of life?
840
00:35:25,130 --> 00:35:26,130
The more, the merrier.
841
00:35:26,150 --> 00:35:27,270
Well, tell me more about it.
842
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:28,180
We fucking spent it, ain't we?
843
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:30,210
It's just their tough shit.
844
00:35:30,230 --> 00:35:31,190
[Grundy]:
It's what?
845
00:35:31,210 --> 00:35:33,010
Nothing. A rude word.
846
00:35:33,030 --> 00:35:34,110
Next question.
847
00:35:34,130 --> 00:35:35,170
[Grundy]: No, no.
848
00:35:35,190 --> 00:35:36,160
What was the rude word?
849
00:35:36,180 --> 00:35:38,090
Shit.
850
00:35:38,110 --> 00:35:40,010
Was it really?
Good heavens.
851
00:35:40,030 --> 00:35:42,080
I think young people watching that now
852
00:35:42,100 --> 00:35:44,030
would say,
"What's the big deal?"
853
00:35:44,050 --> 00:35:46,090
But you didn't swear on TV
in those days,
854
00:35:46,110 --> 00:35:47,140
so when they started swearing,
855
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:50,070
and Bill Grundy got angry
and made them swear more,
856
00:35:50,090 --> 00:35:51,230
everyone was a bit shocked.
857
00:35:52,010 --> 00:35:53,120
...or are you just
enjoying yourself?
858
00:35:53,140 --> 00:35:55,170
I'm enjoying myself.
I always wanted to meet you.
859
00:35:55,190 --> 00:35:57,070
- Did you really?
- Yeah.
860
00:35:57,090 --> 00:35:58,060
[Grundy]: We'll meet
afterwards, shall we?
861
00:35:58,080 --> 00:35:59,150
Doubt it.
862
00:35:59,170 --> 00:36:02,050
[Steve Jones]: You dirty sod.
You dirty old man.
863
00:36:02,070 --> 00:36:03,150
[Grundy]:
Go on, again.
864
00:36:03,170 --> 00:36:05,030
You dirty fucker.
865
00:36:05,050 --> 00:36:07,080
- What a clever boy.
- What a fucking rotter.
866
00:36:07,100 --> 00:36:08,100
[Grundy]: Well, that's it
for tonight.
867
00:36:08,120 --> 00:36:10,020
[Vanian]: When they came back,
868
00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:12,020
Malcolm was shouting at them
869
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:14,100
because he thought
they had ruined their career.
870
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:15,160
After that, he would say
871
00:36:15,180 --> 00:36:17,180
that he had instigated the whole thing,
872
00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:20,060
and he'd, you know...
he wanted that to happen,
873
00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:21,100
but in actual fact,
874
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:23,060
he thought that
that was going to destroy them,
875
00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:24,150
but the next day,
876
00:36:24,170 --> 00:36:27,140
they were on the front page
of every newspaper
877
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:29,120
across the country.
878
00:36:31,020 --> 00:36:32,300
[Letts]:
That Bill Grundy program
879
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:35,020
kind of signaled the end
880
00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:37,200
of one part of
the punk rock story in the UK,
881
00:36:37,220 --> 00:36:40,080
because all of a sudden,
people think, "Okay,
882
00:36:40,100 --> 00:36:42,020
that's what punk's about,
883
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:44,060
being outrageous, saying 'fuck you, '
884
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:46,130
all the negativity
and nihilism."
885
00:36:46,150 --> 00:36:48,030
I mean, it's interesting,
the media's role
886
00:36:48,050 --> 00:36:50,080
in kind of driving
these subcultural movements,
887
00:36:50,100 --> 00:36:51,130
because what they do
888
00:36:51,150 --> 00:36:54,110
is they create these urban folk devils,
889
00:36:54,130 --> 00:36:56,110
you know what I mean,
and kind of kill something
890
00:36:56,130 --> 00:37:00,070
before it's had a chance
to really grow and develop.
891
00:37:00,090 --> 00:37:02,030
[Albertine]: That was
the beginning of the end,
892
00:37:02,050 --> 00:37:03,070
because I think probably
from that day on
893
00:37:03,090 --> 00:37:05,210
was when the label "punk" came out,
894
00:37:05,230 --> 00:37:08,180
and when a whole load of out-of-towners
895
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:10,030
started turning up at gigs,
896
00:37:10,050 --> 00:37:11,450
and we weren't underground anymore.
897
00:37:13,210 --> 00:37:15,030
[Vanian]: We had a few gigs
898
00:37:15,050 --> 00:37:19,110
where people came to the shows
just to destroy the show,
899
00:37:19,130 --> 00:37:22,070
and just to probably kill us as well.
900
00:37:22,090 --> 00:37:23,110
So you'd end up...
901
00:37:23,130 --> 00:37:25,220
One particular one was us...
902
00:37:26,000 --> 00:37:27,120
everything was being thrown,
903
00:37:27,140 --> 00:37:29,080
chairs, all kinds of stuff,
904
00:37:29,100 --> 00:37:32,210
and then we were outside
trying to get back in our van,
905
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:34,220
and there was a line of guys
906
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,170
with chains and hammers
and God knows what else
907
00:37:37,190 --> 00:37:39,040
coming down the road,
908
00:37:39,060 --> 00:37:41,080
and they were going
to sort us out, basically.
909
00:37:41,100 --> 00:37:42,200
You know, they had
the Anarchy tour lined up,
910
00:37:42,220 --> 00:37:44,000
I think 20 dates.
911
00:37:44,020 --> 00:37:45,140
I think they ended up playing,
like, four dates.
912
00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:47,160
You know, people were
coming out in their hordes
913
00:37:47,180 --> 00:37:50,070
singing hymns outside the venues
914
00:37:50,090 --> 00:37:51,130
to stop their kids getting in.
915
00:37:51,150 --> 00:37:53,080
And all of them said,
916
00:37:53,100 --> 00:37:55,080
"We don't want this on our stages.
917
00:37:55,100 --> 00:37:56,120
We're banning it,"
918
00:37:56,140 --> 00:37:58,020
so it was banned across the country.
919
00:37:58,040 --> 00:38:00,120
I mean, John was literally
the antichrist
920
00:38:00,140 --> 00:38:01,130
for about a week,
921
00:38:01,150 --> 00:38:03,190
and, you know, I mean,
it sounds funny now,
922
00:38:03,210 --> 00:38:05,000
but, you know, it ended up
923
00:38:05,020 --> 00:38:07,010
with him getting kind of
attacked on the streets, man.
924
00:38:07,030 --> 00:38:08,030
You know, people were slashing him
925
00:38:08,050 --> 00:38:09,080
with knives and things.
926
00:38:09,100 --> 00:38:12,030
I mean, that's why
he had to leave the UK.
927
00:38:12,050 --> 00:38:14,170
He couldn't stay here.
928
00:38:14,190 --> 00:38:16,190
["The Star-Spangled Banner" plays]
929
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:25,220
[Rotten]: When the Pistols
first went to America,
930
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:27,110
well, my God, I mean,
931
00:38:27,130 --> 00:38:31,140
there were no gigs open to us, really.
932
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:34,150
No promoter wanted to deal with us,
933
00:38:34,170 --> 00:38:37,220
at least that's what
the manager was telling us,
934
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:39,190
so we ended up doing really
935
00:38:39,210 --> 00:38:42,130
the country and western
tour of the South,
936
00:38:42,150 --> 00:38:44,210
and they loved it.
937
00:38:47,110 --> 00:38:48,070
[Bob Gruen]:
When the Sex Pistols
938
00:38:48,090 --> 00:38:49,130
came to America,
939
00:38:49,150 --> 00:38:51,200
they did Malcolm's idea
of playing across the South.
940
00:38:51,220 --> 00:38:52,660
He wanted to play in front of people
941
00:38:53,010 --> 00:38:54,060
who didn't know who they were
942
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:57,020
that would get really riled up
and insulted and angry,
943
00:38:57,040 --> 00:38:58,220
which worked in the South.
944
00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:00,050
I think I heard one time
945
00:39:00,070 --> 00:39:02,050
that they urinated
on the audience one time.
946
00:39:02,070 --> 00:39:03,040
Why, I don't know.
947
00:39:03,060 --> 00:39:04,040
It just sounds goofy.
948
00:39:04,060 --> 00:39:05,160
They kind of upset me.
949
00:39:05,180 --> 00:39:07,090
Fuck, no.
They're garbage, man.
950
00:39:07,110 --> 00:39:08,130
They're garbage.
951
00:39:08,150 --> 00:39:10,150
[McNeil]: When the Pistols
came to America,
952
00:39:10,170 --> 00:39:12,140
all of a sudden, overnight,
953
00:39:12,160 --> 00:39:14,230
America discovered punk music.
954
00:39:15,010 --> 00:39:16,230
Every night on the news,
955
00:39:17,010 --> 00:39:19,100
Walter Cronkite was saying,
"And the Sex Pistols..."
956
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:21,100
and they'd show helicopter shots
957
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:24,090
of the tour bus driving
through the deep South,
958
00:39:24,110 --> 00:39:28,040
and, you know, there'd be
all these people protesting,
959
00:39:28,060 --> 00:39:31,000
and the Pistols
were causing pandemonium.
960
00:39:31,020 --> 00:39:34,010
Because punk is not
a valid form of music here
961
00:39:34,030 --> 00:39:35,030
in the States.
962
00:39:35,050 --> 00:39:37,180
That's the first time you saw UK punks,
963
00:39:37,200 --> 00:39:39,230
and they were just, like,
throttling each other,
964
00:39:40,010 --> 00:39:42,130
and pogoing, and spitting,
and all this kind of stuff.
965
00:39:43,060 --> 00:39:44,190
These are really important signifiers.
966
00:39:44,210 --> 00:39:47,030
I mean, they kind of
make you want to know more,
967
00:39:47,050 --> 00:39:48,120
and, like, with that name,
968
00:39:48,140 --> 00:39:51,000
like, what band would
call themselves "Sex Pistols"?
969
00:39:51,020 --> 00:39:54,160
The Pistols are just out of sight.
970
00:39:54,180 --> 00:39:56,030
I think they got a lot of balls.
971
00:39:56,050 --> 00:39:57,100
One night on stage,
972
00:39:57,120 --> 00:39:59,030
somebody had said something
or threw something,
973
00:39:59,050 --> 00:40:02,200
and Sid actually hit the guy
with his guitar.
974
00:40:02,220 --> 00:40:04,040
Later, after the show,
975
00:40:04,060 --> 00:40:05,100
Malcolm ran up to me
976
00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:07,360
and said, "Do you have a picture
of Sid hitting the guy?"
977
00:40:08,010 --> 00:40:09,210
And in my normal life,
978
00:40:09,230 --> 00:40:11,270
if a guy in a band had
hit somebody in the audience,
979
00:40:12,010 --> 00:40:13,850
that was something
that you would want to hide,
980
00:40:14,010 --> 00:40:16,020
and you wouldn't want to publicize,
981
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:17,080
but Malcolm was dying to get a picture
982
00:40:17,100 --> 00:40:19,030
to put it on the front page
of the English paper
983
00:40:19,050 --> 00:40:20,160
to create more controversy.
984
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:26,100
America was a divided country,
985
00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:28,070
and in a weird way,
986
00:40:28,090 --> 00:40:32,050
the Sex Pistols united it.
987
00:40:34,060 --> 00:40:36,010
[Gruen]: But the fact
that it was news anywhere
988
00:40:36,030 --> 00:40:37,180
really surprised me.
989
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:39,010
I think the first surprise, actually,
990
00:40:39,030 --> 00:40:40,110
when I got to Atlanta,
991
00:40:40,130 --> 00:40:42,140
there was a representative
from the LA Times,
992
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:43,140
from the New York Times,
993
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:44,150
from Rolling Stone,
994
00:40:44,170 --> 00:40:45,490
from several different magazines,
995
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:46,220
all my colleagues.
996
00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:48,560
Like, serious photographers were there,
997
00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:50,150
and I didn't know that they even knew
998
00:40:50,170 --> 00:40:53,120
who this band
from England was, you know?
999
00:40:53,140 --> 00:40:54,140
So I was very surprised
1000
00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:56,080
that there was so much news about them.
1001
00:40:56,100 --> 00:40:58,060
Well, after the show,
as they were leaving,
1002
00:40:58,080 --> 00:40:59,190
and everybody was getting on the bus,
1003
00:40:59,210 --> 00:41:01,080
I was saying goodbye to Malcolm,
1004
00:41:01,100 --> 00:41:02,180
and I said, you know,
"Have a great trip.
1005
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:03,210
I'm sure you're going
to have a lot of fun.
1006
00:41:03,230 --> 00:41:05,020
It's too bad I can't come along,
1007
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:06,070
but I'm sure it's going to be great.
1008
00:41:06,090 --> 00:41:07,200
Goodbye and good luck."
1009
00:41:07,220 --> 00:41:09,110
And he said,
"Oh, well, Bob, you can't come
1010
00:41:09,130 --> 00:41:11,030
because we're only allowed
12 on the bus,
1011
00:41:11,050 --> 00:41:12,100
and there's Sophie, and the band,
1012
00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:13,150
and the guards and me.
1013
00:41:13,170 --> 00:41:14,220
Oh, that's only 11, Bob.
1014
00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:16,110
Why don't you get on the bus?"
1015
00:41:16,130 --> 00:41:17,150
And I was like, "What?"
1016
00:41:17,170 --> 00:41:19,050
And the guy next to me,
another photographer,
1017
00:41:19,070 --> 00:41:20,090
said, "Oh, I'll come, Malcolm,"
1018
00:41:20,110 --> 00:41:22,210
and Malcolm said, "No, sorry.
Bob asked first,"
1019
00:41:22,230 --> 00:41:24,170
and I didn't remember asking,
1020
00:41:24,190 --> 00:41:26,010
but I got on the bus,
1021
00:41:26,030 --> 00:41:29,000
and ended up in San Francisco
10 days later
1022
00:41:29,020 --> 00:41:31,230
after a wild ride across America.
1023
00:41:32,010 --> 00:41:33,130
[♪♪♪]
1024
00:41:33,150 --> 00:41:37,060
Being on the bus,
we were kind of insulated.
1025
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:38,210
It was really calm on the bus.
1026
00:41:38,230 --> 00:41:41,090
We were basically smoking pot
and drinking beer
1027
00:41:41,110 --> 00:41:42,130
and listening to reggae music,
1028
00:41:42,150 --> 00:41:45,000
so basically, we were just
sitting there, you know,
1029
00:41:45,020 --> 00:41:48,030
having a pretty mild buzz,
watching America go by,
1030
00:41:48,050 --> 00:41:50,220
and then we'd get to a venue,
and the door would open,
1031
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:52,190
and there would be
press people out there.
1032
00:41:52,210 --> 00:41:54,080
I remember one time
1033
00:41:54,100 --> 00:41:56,120
some TV cameras right outside the door.
1034
00:41:56,140 --> 00:41:58,000
Steve Jones kind of looked at 'em,
1035
00:41:58,020 --> 00:42:00,000
and he cleared his throat
and spit on the ground,
1036
00:42:00,020 --> 00:42:02,220
ready to talk or answer a question,
1037
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,120
and the press said, "Oh, my God,
he's spitting at us!"
1038
00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:07,220
So they never even asked a question,
1039
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,090
but there seemed to be
chaos around them.
1040
00:42:11,110 --> 00:42:12,180
Looking back,
1041
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:15,150
there's very little footage
actually of Sid Vicious...
1042
00:42:16,170 --> 00:42:20,200
you know, where you can
actually see Sid being Sid,
1043
00:42:20,220 --> 00:42:22,080
and in the few interviews there are,
1044
00:42:22,100 --> 00:42:24,180
he's a junkie who's kind of
mumbling and drooling,
1045
00:42:24,200 --> 00:42:26,230
and barely audible.
1046
00:42:27,010 --> 00:42:28,090
He's just fucked up.
1047
00:42:28,110 --> 00:42:31,150
I mean, he's been sick for three months
1048
00:42:31,170 --> 00:42:33,030
that he's been on the road.
1049
00:42:33,050 --> 00:42:34,110
[Chimes]: The thing is,
when you're on tour,
1050
00:42:34,130 --> 00:42:36,070
you're stuck together so closely.
1051
00:42:36,090 --> 00:42:37,450
You're working every day together.
1052
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:39,050
You're traveling together.
1053
00:42:39,070 --> 00:42:41,270
It's like being married to
three or four people at once,
1054
00:42:42,010 --> 00:42:43,030
so it does create tension,
1055
00:42:43,050 --> 00:42:45,110
and the tension can get
out of proportion.
1056
00:42:46,140 --> 00:42:47,090
What's your impression of America
1057
00:42:47,110 --> 00:42:49,110
at this point?
1058
00:42:49,130 --> 00:42:50,110
Load of shit.
1059
00:42:50,130 --> 00:42:52,100
[♪♪♪]
1060
00:43:00,010 --> 00:43:01,690
[Penelope Houston]:
At the Winterland show,
1061
00:43:02,010 --> 00:43:05,210
people came from Seattle,
Portland, Los Angeles,
1062
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:07,040
all over the west coast.
1063
00:43:07,060 --> 00:43:08,060
[crowds cheering]
1064
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:09,180
[Houston]:
I mean, it was more people
1065
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:12,000
than the Pistols had ever played to.
1066
00:43:12,020 --> 00:43:14,040
I think it was between 5,000 and 6,000.
1067
00:43:14,060 --> 00:43:15,050
[crowd screaming]
1068
00:43:15,070 --> 00:43:16,190
[Gruen]: The kind of clubs
they were playing
1069
00:43:16,210 --> 00:43:18,000
was a few hundred people,
1070
00:43:18,020 --> 00:43:18,210
and all of a sudden,
1071
00:43:18,230 --> 00:43:20,040
it seemed like a few thousand people,
1072
00:43:20,060 --> 00:43:22,160
so it was a much bigger,
kind of intimidating place,
1073
00:43:22,180 --> 00:43:25,180
and I remember the stage
actually being as big
1074
00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:27,180
as most of the clubs
that they had been playing
1075
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:28,220
on the whole tour.
1076
00:43:31,030 --> 00:43:32,080
[Houston]: People came there
1077
00:43:32,100 --> 00:43:34,000
thinking they were going
to a punk rock show,
1078
00:43:34,020 --> 00:43:35,210
but had never been to a punk rock show,
1079
00:43:35,230 --> 00:43:38,120
so they were going to act as "punk rock"
1080
00:43:38,140 --> 00:43:40,040
as they thought they should,
1081
00:43:40,060 --> 00:43:41,150
therefore they were throwing things,
1082
00:43:41,170 --> 00:43:43,010
and spitting on the stage,
1083
00:43:43,030 --> 00:43:44,160
and giving the finger,
1084
00:43:44,180 --> 00:43:48,170
and just behaving as, you know,
"punk" as they could.
1085
00:43:48,190 --> 00:43:51,140
[crowd screaming and cheering]
1086
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,000
And then when the Pistols played,
1087
00:43:54,020 --> 00:43:57,070
I went out into the audience
to see what it was like,
1088
00:43:57,090 --> 00:43:59,040
and I got as close as I could
to the stage,
1089
00:43:59,060 --> 00:44:01,210
and it was just
so packed tightly with people
1090
00:44:01,230 --> 00:44:03,130
that immediately
you're covered in sweat,
1091
00:44:03,150 --> 00:44:05,020
but it's not your own sweat.
1092
00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:06,190
It's everybody else's sweat,
1093
00:44:06,210 --> 00:44:07,170
and people were kind of
1094
00:44:07,190 --> 00:44:09,070
getting squeezed out of the crowd,
1095
00:44:09,090 --> 00:44:10,200
and handed over the top of the crowd
1096
00:44:10,220 --> 00:44:12,110
and thrown onto the stage,
1097
00:44:12,130 --> 00:44:13,190
and then dragged away.
1098
00:44:15,020 --> 00:44:17,180
It was a...
fairly intense scene.
1099
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:20,050
[crowd screaming]
1100
00:44:20,070 --> 00:44:23,040
Every time I walk on stage,
1101
00:44:23,060 --> 00:44:27,060
I'm dying seven deaths backstage
1102
00:44:27,080 --> 00:44:29,130
of fear and self-doubt,
1103
00:44:29,150 --> 00:44:32,030
and I'm-not-worthiness
1104
00:44:32,050 --> 00:44:34,080
that you could ever imagine.
1105
00:44:34,100 --> 00:44:35,160
All of us do that.
1106
00:44:35,180 --> 00:44:40,180
The making of you
is if you can endure that
1107
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:45,080
and still go out and face the music.
1108
00:44:45,100 --> 00:44:46,150
[crowd screaming]
1109
00:44:46,170 --> 00:44:49,160
[band begins playing
"God Save the Queen"]
1110
00:45:05,150 --> 00:45:08,070
♪ God save the Queen ♪
1111
00:45:08,090 --> 00:45:11,100
♪ A fascist regime ♪
1112
00:45:11,120 --> 00:45:14,150
♪ They made you a moron ♪
1113
00:45:14,170 --> 00:45:17,220
♪ A potential H-bomb ♪
1114
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:20,210
♪ God save the Queen ♪
1115
00:45:20,230 --> 00:45:22,030
♪ She ain't no human being... ♪
1116
00:45:22,050 --> 00:45:24,090
[Rotten]:
Winterland was a strange one.
1117
00:45:24,110 --> 00:45:26,000
♪ ...there is no future... ♪
1118
00:45:26,020 --> 00:45:29,180
[Rotten]:
Every song felt unfinished...
1119
00:45:29,200 --> 00:45:32,010
and I think if you listen to it,
1120
00:45:32,030 --> 00:45:34,150
it shows that.
1121
00:45:34,170 --> 00:45:36,200
It shows that lack of industry.
1122
00:45:38,140 --> 00:45:41,120
[Houston]: The Winterland show
was exciting,
1123
00:45:41,140 --> 00:45:44,030
but it did seem like, you know,
1124
00:45:44,050 --> 00:45:46,220
it wasn't the easiest show for them.
1125
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:49,100
It's hard to know
how they felt about that night.
1126
00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:52,050
[crowd screaming]
1127
00:45:52,070 --> 00:45:53,100
[Albertine]: Sid...
1128
00:45:53,120 --> 00:45:56,000
you could see he was on a downhill roll,
1129
00:45:56,020 --> 00:45:58,190
and drugs had got ahold of him.
1130
00:46:02,050 --> 00:46:04,180
You make excuses
for members in your band
1131
00:46:04,200 --> 00:46:09,230
indulging in the more
hardcore-y drugs, you know,
1132
00:46:10,010 --> 00:46:13,060
the heroins of...
shall we say.
1133
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:19,050
But you don't be doing that
before you go on stage.
1134
00:46:19,070 --> 00:46:22,040
Ever get the feeling
you've been cheated?
1135
00:46:27,230 --> 00:46:30,210
I think they were all
pretty burnt out at that point,
1136
00:46:30,230 --> 00:46:33,230
either with being on tour
or being in the band.
1137
00:46:37,140 --> 00:46:38,140
[Gruen]:
I came back to New York
1138
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:40,200
as soon as the tour was over.
1139
00:46:40,220 --> 00:46:42,220
I spent about the next two or three days
1140
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:44,130
developing my film
and making lots of prints,
1141
00:46:44,150 --> 00:46:45,200
because there were so many magazines
1142
00:46:45,220 --> 00:46:47,180
that were going to print
so many stories about them,
1143
00:46:47,200 --> 00:46:51,130
but I went to CBGBs the next day.
1144
00:46:51,150 --> 00:46:54,080
I walked across the city
and went to CBGBs,
1145
00:46:54,100 --> 00:46:55,050
and I walked in,
1146
00:46:55,070 --> 00:46:56,060
and Johnny Rotten was sitting there
1147
00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:57,130
with a friend of mine,
1148
00:46:57,150 --> 00:46:59,170
and he said,
"Have you heard the news, mate?"
1149
00:46:59,190 --> 00:47:01,220
and I'm like,
"What do you mean?"
1150
00:47:02,000 --> 00:47:03,150
and he said, "Well, we broke up, mate.
1151
00:47:03,170 --> 00:47:05,140
That's it, the band's over,"
1152
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:07,120
and I was stunned.
1153
00:47:07,140 --> 00:47:08,090
I was like, you know,
1154
00:47:08,110 --> 00:47:09,170
"But the whole world is watching.
1155
00:47:09,190 --> 00:47:11,010
You're the biggest band
in the world this week."
1156
00:47:11,030 --> 00:47:13,070
He says, "Nope.
The band is over. We broke up."
1157
00:47:17,100 --> 00:47:19,190
[John Holmstrom]:
When the Pistols broke up
1158
00:47:19,210 --> 00:47:23,150
in early January 1978,
1159
00:47:23,170 --> 00:47:26,100
they sucked all the air out of the room.
1160
00:47:26,120 --> 00:47:27,060
They were it.
1161
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:28,180
They were punk rock.
1162
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:30,140
People had forgotten the Ramones,
1163
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:32,180
didn't care about the Dead Boys.
1164
00:47:32,200 --> 00:47:34,220
The Damned were on the side.
1165
00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:35,230
So when they broke up,
1166
00:47:36,010 --> 00:47:38,160
that was pretty much
the end of punk rock.
1167
00:47:38,180 --> 00:47:42,230
[Vanian]: Well, I think
everybody wanted punk to fail.
1168
00:47:43,010 --> 00:47:44,040
I mean, that's the thing,
1169
00:47:44,060 --> 00:47:47,130
it was such a short-lived period
when you look at it.
1170
00:47:47,150 --> 00:47:49,010
[snaps fingers] Gone,
1171
00:47:49,030 --> 00:47:51,080
but that's the same
with anything, you know.
1172
00:47:51,100 --> 00:47:54,060
But it didn't die an easy death,
1173
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:57,030
because then you had
another nail in the coffin
1174
00:47:57,050 --> 00:48:00,150
when the Sid and Nancy thing happened.
1175
00:48:00,170 --> 00:48:02,150
A young man who called
himself Sid Vicious,
1176
00:48:02,170 --> 00:48:04,160
and whose real name is John Ritchie,
1177
00:48:04,180 --> 00:48:06,130
called New York City Police
late this morning
1178
00:48:06,150 --> 00:48:09,090
to say that he had found
his girlfriend, Nancy Spungen,
1179
00:48:09,110 --> 00:48:11,150
dead at their hotel room at the Chelsea,
1180
00:48:11,170 --> 00:48:13,150
a favorite hangout for entertainers.
1181
00:48:13,170 --> 00:48:14,290
Police say that he confessed
1182
00:48:15,010 --> 00:48:16,130
that he had killed the Pennsylvania girl
1183
00:48:16,150 --> 00:48:17,190
during an argument,
1184
00:48:17,210 --> 00:48:20,190
and a large hunting knife
was found in the room.
1185
00:48:20,210 --> 00:48:23,000
It kind of proved what mainstream media
1186
00:48:23,020 --> 00:48:24,200
had been saying all along, you know.
1187
00:48:24,220 --> 00:48:25,210
"They're imbeciles.
1188
00:48:25,230 --> 00:48:27,030
They can't sing.
1189
00:48:27,050 --> 00:48:29,090
They can't play their instruments,
1190
00:48:29,110 --> 00:48:30,180
and they kill each other.
1191
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:32,020
They kill their girlfriends."
1192
00:48:32,040 --> 00:48:34,020
You know, that's what punk had become.
1193
00:48:34,040 --> 00:48:36,150
So, you know...
1194
00:48:36,170 --> 00:48:39,000
it was a shame.
1195
00:48:39,020 --> 00:48:41,150
[Gruen]: And so it was
really kind of weird.
1196
00:48:41,170 --> 00:48:43,180
I remember Sid coming to a Blondie show
1197
00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:46,210
after he got out of jail,
1198
00:48:46,230 --> 00:48:48,230
and people not really knowing
how to take it.
1199
00:48:49,010 --> 00:48:50,170
Like, he was another musician
that we had liked.
1200
00:48:50,190 --> 00:48:52,060
Just a month earlier,
1201
00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:54,040
he had played Max's,
1202
00:48:54,060 --> 00:48:55,090
and people were getting to know Sid,
1203
00:48:55,110 --> 00:48:56,160
and all of a sudden, Nancy was dead,
1204
00:48:56,180 --> 00:48:58,130
and was it his fault or not?
1205
00:48:58,150 --> 00:49:01,140
Nobody seemed to know.
He didn't seem to know.
1206
00:49:02,190 --> 00:49:06,050
You know, we were just
a giant explosion,
1207
00:49:06,070 --> 00:49:08,190
or like a rocket
that was going to the moon,
1208
00:49:08,210 --> 00:49:10,130
and we just had to come down
at some point.
1209
00:49:10,150 --> 00:49:13,010
We just made sure, some of us, at least,
1210
00:49:13,030 --> 00:49:15,160
got out of the way
before the damage was done.
1211
00:49:18,050 --> 00:49:19,080
[news report]:
The short, violent life
1212
00:49:19,100 --> 00:49:21,100
of a young man known as Sid Vicious,
1213
00:49:21,120 --> 00:49:22,190
a British punk rock star,
1214
00:49:22,210 --> 00:49:24,010
is over.
1215
00:49:24,030 --> 00:49:25,050
He was charged
1216
00:49:25,070 --> 00:49:26,170
with knifing his girlfriend
to death last fall,
1217
00:49:26,190 --> 00:49:27,160
and his death came
1218
00:49:27,180 --> 00:49:28,170
as he was apparently celebrating
1219
00:49:28,190 --> 00:49:30,180
his release from jail on bond,
1220
00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:31,230
but we understand
1221
00:49:32,010 --> 00:49:34,030
the catalyst
for the celebration was heroin.
1222
00:49:35,180 --> 00:49:36,220
Heroin.
1223
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:39,010
[exhales]
1224
00:49:39,030 --> 00:49:40,210
Wow.
1225
00:49:40,230 --> 00:49:42,120
It kills them all, you know.
1226
00:49:44,070 --> 00:49:47,170
And this is Nancy taught him
all of this,
1227
00:49:47,190 --> 00:49:52,150
and he was too young and dumb
to know any different,
1228
00:49:52,170 --> 00:49:55,090
and the biggest joke of all was
1229
00:49:55,110 --> 00:49:59,120
Sid would never have hooked up
with a girl like Nancy
1230
00:49:59,140 --> 00:50:04,120
unless I introduced her to him...
1231
00:50:06,120 --> 00:50:08,210
which I did,
1232
00:50:08,230 --> 00:50:10,140
and so I take
1233
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:14,080
some really serious
sense of responsibility
1234
00:50:14,100 --> 00:50:15,210
in Sid's demise
1235
00:50:15,230 --> 00:50:18,170
because of that.
1236
00:50:18,190 --> 00:50:20,060
All right?
1237
00:50:21,080 --> 00:50:23,180
I miss my friends.
1238
00:50:34,210 --> 00:50:36,010
[Ian MacKaye]: Most of
what I had learned about punk,
1239
00:50:36,030 --> 00:50:38,160
I had learned from the media,
1240
00:50:38,180 --> 00:50:40,180
and the media, of course, was derisive,
1241
00:50:40,200 --> 00:50:42,060
and they would focus
1242
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:45,220
on the sensationalist
kind of aspects of punk,
1243
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:47,090
and pump that up,
1244
00:50:47,110 --> 00:50:49,030
so I thought, "They're just,
they're idiots.
1245
00:50:49,050 --> 00:50:50,140
They spit into each other's mouths,"
1246
00:50:50,160 --> 00:50:52,190
or whatever, you know?
Whatever the...
1247
00:50:52,210 --> 00:50:55,020
I actually didn't know anything.
1248
00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:57,110
So my older sister and some friends
1249
00:50:57,130 --> 00:50:58,200
lent me some records.
1250
00:50:58,220 --> 00:51:01,010
Sex Pistols' "Never Mind the Bollocks,"
1251
00:51:01,030 --> 00:51:02,040
of course,
1252
00:51:02,060 --> 00:51:04,220
which is a very intimidating record.
1253
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:08,070
I mean, they were terrifying,
1254
00:51:08,090 --> 00:51:10,140
and I think that my tendency
1255
00:51:10,160 --> 00:51:14,090
is to go towards the things
that scare me,
1256
00:51:14,110 --> 00:51:15,100
because there must be a reason,
1257
00:51:15,120 --> 00:51:17,030
because really, when you think about it,
1258
00:51:17,050 --> 00:51:18,490
it's just a fucking piece of plastic
1259
00:51:19,010 --> 00:51:21,010
spinning in a circle.
1260
00:51:21,030 --> 00:51:23,180
What's there to be scared of?
1261
00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:26,060
It must be the ideas.
1262
00:51:27,220 --> 00:51:30,120
[♪♪♪]